Most of the world's biggest cities are on the coast. As sea levels rise and storms worsen, how can we reimagine our coastal cities so that they can survive and thrive in the face of climate change? Today we talk with leaders across 3 continents about how they are fighting for the future of their cities.
PANELISTS:
Dr. Fola Dania - the Chief Resilience Officer of Lagos, Nigeria
Felipe Araujo - the Vice Mayor of Porto, Portugal, and City Counselor for Environment, Climate, Innovation, and Digital Transition
Casi Calloway - The Director of Operations at the Southeast Sustainability Directors Network, and former Chief Resilience Officer of Mobile, Alabama
Janelle Kelman - former mayor of Sausalito, California, founder of Sea Rise Solutions and she's also currently running for Lieutenant Governor of California.
Sea Change is made possible with major support from the Gulf Research Program of the National Academy of Sciences, Engineering, and Medicine. WWNO’s Coastal Desk is supported by the Walton Family Foundation, the Meraux Foundation, and the Greater New Orleans Foundation.
TRANSCRIPT
CARLYLE: Hey Halle.
HALLE: Hey Carlyle. How are you feeling today?
CARLYLE: Well I have this really annoying cold, but I am still so excited and inspired by what we are talking about today.
HALLE: What are we talking about today?
CARLYLE: So I know we obviously live in a city, New Orleans, but something I’ve been thinking about recently that’s kind of mind blowing is just how many people live in cities around world. More than half us, that’s more than 4.5 BILLION people, live in one.
HALLE: Wow, so many of us are just concentrated in the same places.
CARLYLE: giving you colds and stuff. But Yeah, and when you think about what that means when it comes to climate change, it’s even more mind blowing. Especially because so many of our cities are on the coast.
SHEETAL: there are 375 coastal cities in the United States. They are home to 20 percent of the U.S. population. That’s 65 million people. And also, most critically, they're home to communities that are most impacted by climate change.
CARLYLE: That’s Sheetal Shah who is the program director of Urban Ocean Lab. I called her up because I wanted her take on what the future holds for coastal cities. And she started off by telling me just how important coastal cities are.
SHEETAL: So, coastal cities are the sort of crux of everything that happens, ( historically, you know, if you think about where civilization and settlements developed, it's been along the coast. So they have this natural, massive cultural impact on countries, um, across the world and also on how culture, um, is formed and developed.) If you're coming back to what coastal cities do for the US, they contribute billions to our economy, and support millions and millions of jobs. Coastal cities are economic drivers for the American economy.
HALLE: She’s totally right. And that’s not just true for the US. I mean most of the world’s biggest cities are on the coast: Tokyo, Jakarta, Shanghai, Mumbai, Lagos…all on the coast.
SHEETAL: So where you have this sort of convergence of many, many, many people, critical infrastructure, economies, cultures and these intensifying coastal hazards. That is why coastal cities globally are really the sort of central force of how we can move the adaptation conversation forward.
CARLYLE: And this is where Sheetal got all bubbly and excited. Talking about adaptation. About reimagining our cities for the future. There’s so much planning going on right now. She told me about a bunch of projects like wetlands floating on mats in the Boston harbor to protect the city.
SHEETAL: So there's an opportunity here to bring nature to more people in urban areas in a way that both helps safeguard us from climate impacts, but also you know, creates a better life for the people who need it.
HALLE: Wow, so many cool projects going on! Which makes sense, cities have always been centers for innovation, right?.
CARLYLE: Exactly. And, so I’ve been wanting to know more about the people leading the charge, who are stepping up and getting creative when it comes to solutions and ensuring their city survives in the face of a warmer future. And so we gathered a group of some truly inspiring people.
HALLE: (pause)
I’m Carlyle Calhoun.
HALLE: And I’m Halle Parker. And you’re listening to Sea Change.
HALLE: Today’s episode is all about the people leading cities through this time of immense change — and balancing the weight with what seems like boundless hope. Carlyle sat down with the leaders of four different cities spanning 3 continents.
CARLYLE: You’ll hear from some of the top officials in Nigeria, Portugal, California and here on the Gulf Coast from Mobile, Alabama. They’re all dedicated to making their cities as resilient as possible.
HALLE: Carlyle speaks with them after the break. That’s coming up.
ROUNDTABLE
Carlyle: Today we have an amazing group of leaders from coastal cities around the world. Joining us are Dr. Fola Dania, the Chief Resilience Officer of Lagos, Nigeria, Felipe Araujo, the Vice Mayor of Porto, Portugal, and City Counselor for Environment, Climate, Innovation, and Digital Transition. Casi Calloway was the Chief Resilience Officer of Mobile, Alabama. Until very recently, and now has taken on the position as director of operations at the Southeast Sustainability Directors Network, which works across 10 Southern states. and last but not least, Janelle Kelman, the former mayor of Sausalito, California, founder of Sea Rise Solutions, a global nonprofit, And she's also currently running for Lieutenant Governor of California. Welcome everyone. So glad you all could be here.
Carlyle: Well, so, I would love everyone listening to kind of get a sense of where you all live. I want to start off by asking you all to introduce us to the city you live in.And, Fola, let's start with you.
Fola: Okay, so I live in Lagos. Lagos is the economic capital of Nigeria. It's, about 3, 557 square kilometers. 40 percent of it is make up made up of water. It And the city itself is a melting pot of tribes. It's a land of opportunities It's considered the last bus stop where you make it or die trying as I say you have like 85 people coming into Lagos per minute and most of them never leave. So we have over 26 million residents that call Lagos home and it's a lovely place to live. Everything moves fast. There's never a dull moment. And one last thing, we don't say welcome to Lagos. We say this is Lagos.
Carlyle: Sounds like an amazing place, and we'll stay international right now. Filipe, introduce us to Porto.
Filipe: So Porto is a very historical city, with narrow streets. You can feel the centuries of history that are embedded in the architecture in the streets, in the iconic river that we have, the city where was the ancient port. And it's also a city that blends the traditional innovation.It's the home of a lot of universities, a lot of research centers, and there is also a big, strong and sense of community in the city. It’s known, Porto, as a warm and hospitality city to welcome everyone.
Carlyle: Wonderful. And Janelle, Tell us about where you live.
Janelle: I'm coming to you from Sausalito, California. We are the first city right over the Golden Gate Bridge on the other side of San Francisco. We are bayfront on Richardson Bay.
We originally settled by the coastal Miwok people and then ultimately Portuguese wooden boat builders came to settle Sausalito. And we still have a vibrant, uh, boat building maritime community. And although we're only 1.1 miles long, everything revolves around our water. Um, so it's absolutely one of the most beautiful jewels, I think, of California and you're all invited. So let me know.
Carlyle: And Casi, let's bring it, bring it back home to the Gulf coast. Tell us about Mobile.
Casi: Yes, and I have, you know, we have our little competition between Mobile and New Orleans, as you can probably know well, but we are the oldest city on the northern Gulf Coast founded a little bit before New Orleans and have also the first Mardi Gras in New Orleans. America.
Carlyle: I knew you were going to drop that.
Casi: you knew I would, but we are a water city. We are historic city, hospitality, celebration… Those are pieces of our culture. It's deeply, deeply rooted in us.
So we grow up, our lives revolve around. Beaches in the summers, bays in the fall, hiding and getting lost in the Mobile Tensaw Delta. We live, eat and breathe nature and our natural environment, but we're also, you know, the reddest of the red States and the buckle of the Bible belt in so many ways. We love our culture. We love our history. We love our beautiful, beautiful place. And we also have a weird sense of protecting it. Don't you touch it. But we also don't want anybody else to tell us what to do.
Carlyle: Mm hmm. Mm hmm. Well, all of us here live in coastal cities. And as you all were just describing, these cities history and prosperity have depended on their coastal location.But now because of climate change, that location has become a threat. So let's talk about the biggest threats that your cities now face. Filipe, can we start with you?
Felipe: Yeah, of course. First of all, the coastal over topping right now when we have big waves. There is a part of the city, that is on the seafront, that we have to simply cut and not allow people to go there. which was not a concern some years ago. Now it's becoming a concern.
The other thing is when we have storms and this, this kind of events is that Porto has 85 kilometers of water running mostly underground in the city. So, uh, we are trying to uncover them and to bring to the surface in order to cope with the flood and the same events. Uh, but for example, we have one problem that we never had before.
We have to, reallocate, a bunch of houses that we are going to demolish Because this the in extreme events This was already causing some problems in these places and putting people in danger. So what we had, we had to, to buy this land and to move these people around in a specific part of the city.
What we are going to do now with this land is we are going to build a new green park, and we are going and trying to cope with water in this green park so we can not put more people in danger. So these are the two examples that maybe I can bring to. To help visualize what we are now facing at, uh, it's important.
Carlyle: Yeah, well, it sounds like both, difficult challenges, but also that you all have some really innovative, cool projects going on, which is exciting. And, um, Casey, Mobile is, is not built, on a hillside. It is not built on high elevation. So tell us about what's going on in Mobile and maybe if there's a story that can kind of exemplify some of these new threats.
Casi: I think there are two things I'll tell is number one. the city of Mobile is now the fastest growing port in the nation, And we've been the fastest growing container port for the past several years. That's a big chunk of not just the economy locally, but the state's economy.
So when you're looking at sea level rise and what that's. Starting to do to our community we have a lot of industry right on the right on the waterfront, right down in the bay that is the port, but immediately behind it.
You have so many low income communities, 1 of the areas that I worked on the most, and we'll continue to fight for, even from this, this new seat is redoing old infrastructure. So we have. So much, you know, being a several hundred year old city, we haven't upgraded some of our infrastructure for several hundred years, or at least several decades in particular, this area of growth along the bay.
The basic is that we're trying to build new. Shipbuilding in an area that has over a hundred year old pipes, sewer lines, stormwater lines, what that means is that the stormwater lines are made of wood, the water lines are cast iron, and the sewer lines are made of terracotta. All of that, as we've grown and as time has happened, when it caved in, we just backed up a dump truck of concrete into the area and filled the hole. What that has also done is backed up sewage integrated sewage and stormwater into the low income communities that are behind those areas.
So the whole area, the industrial side is flooding. So you can't get to work. The community side is flooding with sewage. So we've got health concerns. We've got, you know, growth concerns, economic concerns. It all really intertwines here in coastal Alabama.
The other thing we learned recently is that, we've had nine inches of sea level rise over the last 50 years. But six and a half of those inches came since 2010.
So as we've got sea level rise coming, with old and aging infrastructure, we are seeing consistent and growing problems. We have to invest in that and it's a hard thing to invest in.
Carlyle: and you just brought up two huge things that the Gulf Coast and the Southeast Coast are particularly at risk for. You know, all coastal cities are, but sea level rise rates here along the Gulf and Southeast Coast are some of the highest on the planet. And also there was just a new study for the U.S. that there's 1, 100 critical infrastructure facilities that are at risk of flooding by 2050. Louisiana's number one for the most infrastructure at risk. Janelle, California is also high on that list. so tell us for the whole San Francisco Bay area, what you all are doing.
are looking at in terms of most urgent challenges right now.
Janelle: I would say that at a very high level, California, like other places in the United States have a lot of aging infrastructure. And a lot of that is around, sewage conveyance. a lot of it is around electricity, a lot of it is around water. And that's a big problem for the state, especially as we're seeing, you know, climate change causing, greater storm events, more intensity, more rainfall coming in a single period.
And so, you know, if I just do a sort of a macro look at this, um, back, I think it was the February of this year, there were some big rain events in California. and Long Beach, which is south of here, had five million gallons of sewage spill into Long Beach's bays and waters. I mean, that's an enormous amount. Part of that was the over saturation, if you will, of the existing infrastructure and water facilities here in Sausalito. And I didn't mention it earlier. We're hillside community. So we're, you know, we're not Porto, but you imagine kind of that cascading hillside. On one side, we have the Golden Gate National Recreation Area. On the other side, we have the bay. We have one main way in and out. And if you live in California in 2018, you woke up to some smoky, dark skies and you realize this risk of wildfire was real. You began to think about evacuation routes and you began to think more about public safety. And then you think to yourself, Okay, well, my one way in and out floods. What do I do?
Carlyle: Yeah, and I mean, thinking about public health and safety and all of these challenges. Fola, you live in a city of 26 million people and you're also a doctor. So can you talk to us about just what all of these challenges mean for the people of Lagos?
Fola: so I'm listening to other people and I'm wondering, do we have problems? Yes, we do. Yes, we do. I'll take it from the perspective of, our own climate impact drivers. And we look at, things like extreme rainfall, extreme heat, and sea level rise. So from a health perspective, when you look at extreme rainfall, as you're already thinking around floods, you're Floods will lead to contamination of surface water that could result in waterborne illnesses for us like cholera, typhoid fever, dysentery and the likes. More breeding sites as in for insects like mosquitoes and that could result also in an increase in the incidence of malaria. you see people that are permanently in a state of tension as in once it starts raining as in because there's a risk that their buildings could actually collapse.
So you have it affecting people's mental health. Climate change as in is actually a health problem also.
And if you look at the central point of all this, as you see is really around land use planning and how do we do this correctly in a way that it protects the vulnerable in our communities.
And we need to begin to think about how to, strengthen our infrastructure to ensure that they are climate resilient because we know that it's still great now, but we have impacts that are gonna be very great, as in if we do nothing and we see that there are costs that could come to us in Lagos, that could be as high as between 33 and $39 billion.
And this might not seem a lot as in to people in the Northern Hemisphere. But that is almost like 12 times our annual budget and that for us is a major problem.
Carlyle: I'm glad you got to the money because this is something I'm sure that cities, governments, everybody, all of us are thinking about as we kind of face these increasing threats. So how are you all communicating with the public about selling the need to do these really expensive projects? And where are you finding the money? How are you all thinking about money? And Janelle, I know you think about this a lot. and that's what you're working on with a lot of your collaboration. So maybe you can kick it off with how you're thinking about this.
Janelle: Yeah, you're right. It's going to be really expensive. A report came out recently that had the updates to the San Francisco Bay area and the billions, like many communities and the billions to adjust to sea level rise and climate change. And so one of the things that I am really interested right now is to move beyond the idea of collaboration into coordination.
And the distinction that I see between the two is collaboration, is I wanna share ideas with you. I'm, we'll have some shared learnings. If you have questions, we can come together. we'll collaborate on ideas, but coordination is so much harder. That's a sharing of resources across jurisdictional boundaries.
And I think that's where the real impact and opportunity is, because now you understand that when it comes to things like water or a heat event, you can't control where they are going.
You can't control the impact, which community is going to get hit or not. And I've said before, um, in convenings that the competitive grant process is killing communities Opportunities to take action today. And what I mean by that is if I have to compete against my neighbors for like a sea level rise or a flooding grant, it really doesn't make sense because the water doesn't care that my jurisdiction stops or ends at one point.
We should be sharing those resources as much as possible. As possible and planning and coordinating those planning efforts together.
Carlyle: Yeah. And Filipe, in Porto, I was reading about all of these projects that you're doing. I mean, you all have, the solar installation is huge. You've got green roofs across, acres and acres of the city. You've got this big new green park that's acting like a sponge.
Felipe: Permeable pavement. it seems like you're kind of, Doing it all. So I'm just, um, wondering if, do you have it figured out, the money?
Filipe: Yeah,well, Of course money will be an issue, is always an issue when we are trying to do things. Uh, but especially I think the biggest concern that I have for years now is to have the strategic plan and the, the master plan that everyone is on a part of it. I think that's very, very important.
So that's, that's the first thing. So put everyone on board. And of course, it's all about the public, also, but a lot in the private sector. So what the private sector will do in the forthcoming years that will help the city to be more resilient, it's all about the nature based solutions, the green roofs and many other things that we are trying to promote.
And in my opinion, cities are the ones that can lead this, change because we have the people,
So we are the ones, of course, cities are also the main responses of the problems that we are facing. We have to be clear about it. But we are the ones that could lead the transformation
Fola: Also, in terms of the money this week, as we launched the Lagos State Climate Adaptation and Resilience Plan, which actually looks at. which adaptation projects we should actually prioritize, and this was done in in collaboration with the private sector also, and we identified about 33 different projects, It will cost us about 9 billion to implement some of it, and we actually took a deep dive into the various financing mechanisms by which we'll be able to implement it. Because we know that nobody is going to hand it over to us.
You have countries in the North, as in Northern Hemisphere, that would have easier access to funding, but for us, it's quite difficult to access funding. So I understand in terms of competing needs, when you look at the needs of the global South and compared to the needs of the global North, as when you approach financiers, as in, it is less likely that we will be prioritized as in our problems might not be as much as that in the global north, but we are the ones that will have more vulnerable and maybe do not have as much financial capacity to be able to address, this needs as in, but we will not stay silent. We'll continue to fight for this. And we identified that nobody's going to do it for us. We're going to do it for ourselves.
Carlyle: Yeah, and Fola, I'm glad you brought that up because that's something I wanted to make sure we talked about is we all know that the wealthiest countries and the wealthiest individuals are responsible for the most carbon emissions that are creating climate change. And so what you were just getting to is what kind of the term people use as climate equity and making sure that Everyone's protected, not just the wealthy cities that are set up to get the grants, and they've got the people who fill out the, you know, know the ropes and know the way the systems work and are connected to the systems.
So how do you all think about making sure that, that everyone where you live is protected?
Fola: so one of the things that we've begun to do is we began to, mainstream climate adaptation into our policies as in so that people are not left behind. And the idea is for us to be able to, build climate resilient infrastructure across the state.
If we do nothing, 5 percent of the entire state will be non dated with water.
We would have to relocate 700,000 people from permanently flooded areas, that is going to cost us 6 billion to do. We will have damage to critical infrastructure, whether it's transportation networks, whether it's our power grids, our communication networks of about 5 billion. And that is something that we cannot afford.
So what we are trying to do now is to first of all direct the funding that is available to the areas that are most impacted and begin to build climate resilient infrastructure in those places and also the protection of our wetlands as because that's also natural infrastructure. And then ensuring that the new developments that come on board as in our already climate resilient, we're ensuring that is going into our policies into our building codes to ensure that we're not creating additional problems with the new developments that are actually coming on board.
Janelle: I'd like to comment real quick, just on On that last question and what follow was offering, and then get my feedback from my astute colleagues here.
It seems to me that there needs to be, an understanding and a push towards, we're not just trying to do something that is better for the environment and better for intergenerational equity.
We're trying to do something that is better, period, right where we're taking action for nature based solutions or coastal adaptation or more resilient community is something that is just the better way of doing business. It is more efficient is more economically sustainable. It has more long term economic benefits for more people.
And so I'm wondering what y'all think about kind of that transition to stop bifurcating this either or are we doing work for climate? Are we doing work for the economy and finding a way to say, this is actually the same thing. If we do it correctly, it will be more sustainable, be more economically resilient.
Fola: Yeah, you're correct. And that's what we're trying to do in Lagos because there's no point having a different conversation about this because it is the same conversation. If I'm trying to develop infrastructure, Why would I not build something that will last longer?
irrespective of whatever it is that is coming to affect it as in whether it's the climate that is coming to affect it, whether it's the increase in our population that is going to affect it because we see, we say we're 26 million today, as in projections show that in LA cost by 2100 will be between 80 to a hundred million people on this same space.
How do we ensure that that infrastructure lasts? Long.
Casi: our conversations are always kind of that weird. If you are focused on the environment, you are anti business. If you are focused on, long term community protections, whatever those are, then you are seen as someone who is, Of a, you know, this political party or that political party, and we were drawing lines that do not make sense and that are not protective of our own individual features, whatever your economic wealth or background is
And I think that's It's probably the biggest thing we do wrong in our fields is we do not talk enough about how the environment and the economy and our communities are intrinsically connected.
That is the single most important thing that we've got to really change in our, just simply in our language and our terminology. So I don't say climate change a lot. I say changing climate seems really simple and silly, but it really matters.
If you do the right thing for the economy of coastal Alabama, you are almost invariably doing the right thing for our community members. There are places where that's not true. We, we put people in the 40s in the lowest lying communities in the lowest lying areas. We are predominantly for us communities of color, certainly our low income communities.
Now that those communities Our communities, They've been there generations long, and now we're telling them they need to move. If we just say you got to move, we're doing that again, we're doing it wrong. So there are places where we've got to address those kind of more chronic stressors: y'all know the terminology, if the shock is a storm, a hurricane, a big thing, a stressor are those low lying, everyday rumbling things that we've also got to address. which could be education, economy, y'all, for us, they can be pothole.
Something so completely simple seeming, but when you fix those small things for everyone across the community, you end up raising everyone's bottom line or bounce back line so that we can all be better ready and better prepared for the shock that's coming next,
Carlyle: In New Orleans, potholes are not always small things.
Casi: not here either.
Felipe: If I can add something that I usually say also is that when we are talking about the change that we are seeing and it will help us understand the future is that definitely we are talking about New paradigm in terms of economy. if we try to talk without this change in the, in the economy paradigm that we live on, uh, we will not change things.
I think it's something that you take a few minutes just to understand that it's not possible to live as we live right now.
One thing that worries me is that yes, it's true that we have People that have money and, that can invest in this kind of things all the other part of the population that cannot invest in the renewal energy in refurbishing their buildings in many of these aspects, these are the ones that I'm really concerned and that then I think that's the ones that we really have in terms of political and public investment.
We have to really pay attention. That's why, for example, in Porto, we have 12 percent of the population that lives in social houses. But our social houses have been refurbished in the last decade. We have invested more than 170 million in the last years. Just refurbishing them and giving them the right energy efficiency that we want to see in other houses.
But if you look, for example, to change the mobility paradigm, you say you don't want people using their own cars and you want them to go in public transport. The public transport has to compete with the car. Otherwise, people won't change and the money they spent. So it has to be affordable For example, in Porto, it's you have to the Children up to 23 years old. They can write all public transport, the bus, the train and the metro free. They don't pay. So and we have seen a huge increase on mobility on on young people.
We have to lead and to make the change happen. And we have to accelerate. That's one problem that we deal nowadays is that we need to accelerate.
We don't have a lot of time to be waiting on things to get moving by their own.
Carlyle: so you all have talked about why we need to adapt coastal cities as climate impacts increase. And to Philippe's last point, that we need to move faster in our efforts. I want to end on what's possible for the future of coastal cities if we take the actions that are needed. If you could each briefly describe your vision for your city reimagined, and you've got all the money you need to make it happen, what does your city look like?
And Fola, let's start with you.
Fola: if I had all the money in the world and I had to imagine my city, our main mode of transportation is the road is cars. And then in one year, on average, we register 300, 000 additional cars. So if I had all the money and I could redo my city, it will be to redesign it in a transit oriented, um, design approach. As in to make sure that you could walk, as in to the bus stop, as in you have buses, you have the buses, you have the rail, you have the waterways. As I said, the buses, the trains, the boats, all running on renewable energy.
You have all the, all the houses, all the homes as in protected from floods. So you have the seawalls in the right places, the groins in the right places. So there's no inland flooding in any way. The rivers don't flood as in because of the embankments. electricity everywhere. Renewable energy. Right now you have not everyone is connected to the grid and then so everybody connected to the grid that is powered by renewable energy, whether it's wind or solar.
In fact, just thinking about that just makes me weak because it seems like it's so simple, but for us it is so expensive. And that's just two things looking at transportation and electricity.
Carlyle: Casi. You want to go next? What does mobile look like?
Casi: So there are two things. Number one is that we never ever again say we should do it that way, because that's the way we've always done it. I think that would change a lot of our communities across the board.
That's A. But see, B for us is that we, we really do that deep dive. We, we have a whole scale, dig up every road, rebuild sewer water and stormwater lines. Get that right. We have these gorgeous oak trees that are everywhere, just dripping over streets, and they're so beautiful. And I don't want to touch them. But we got to get them out of our stormwater, our sewer lines, so that we can make sure that we are sending water where it needs to be and sewer where it needs to be and doing all of that right.
I think also that simple, there's some simple changes you could do is change the contracts and the bids and the and the proposals for to always say stormwater lines that meet changing climate that meet sea level rise conditions so that when a project is being bid by a Contractor, consultant, engineer, whoever that they're not thinking about it that they're just doing it right.
So that's a simple, simple change.
There are other one on energy because I want everything that's going on in Lagos, please. We'll just take all of that. And the biggest one with that is, is our energy. We actually are prohibitive against doing solar and doing renewable because of the way we've set up our system for our power companies.
We've got a monopoly. They like the way we've always done it. We've got to change that mindset. We really have to have people thinking through our future and thinking about what our future could look like and not just the way we've done things in the past.
Carlyle: Filipe?
Felipe: Well, I think it's good to put in that terms where we can imagine things that we want to, you know, To see in the future. I would say that, the the paradigms in transport. It's available for us to move around in a non polluted way. So it's always very important.
Uh, a city full of green and blue areas where nature based solution poses really good examples and could cope with all the weather and that can affect us. Continues to have these areas available for us to enjoy. if we look to the cities, cities are the ones that, uh, uh, consume more energy in the, in the world.
We would like to be an efficient. Energy consumer, but also produce our own energy and in the future to store the energy that we produce to take advantage of all the possibilities.
And in the end, I would say that it's to have the cities with the people in the center. So we can solve the problems. You gave me the proposal to have all the money in the world. So I'm being more or less given all the solutions.
Carlyle: well, we need all the solutions and we need to be hopeful. And Casey, as you were saying, we can't just repeat the past. So Janelle, what does your reimagined Sausalito look like?
Janelle: Yeah, well, admittedly, I'm inspired by my colleagues here, but I will just say. I use the word resilience a lot, a more resilient city. And that means more resilient infrastructure. That means energy independence. I love the opportunity to solve multiple problems at one time.
So if we want to build out better connectivity for bicycles, let's also make that some type of elevated area. So we're protecting ourselves from storm surge, and then we begin to look at the community with more opportunity.
Some of that, is around challenging existing norms and paradigms around regulation and ordinances. And a few that come to mind for me include more water based housing. you know, we're a waterfront community. Water based housing is part of who Sausalito is. If you Google Sausalito and type in houseboats, you're going to see 400 beautiful, architectural creations.
But, but because of the current regulatory structure, you know, we can't put fill into the bank. It'd be very difficult. Can we create a new paradigm around that and see that we are actually solving? You know, the affordable housing crisis and in a way that is sustainable.
Similarly,you know, electrification of maritime vessels is a huge opportunity for all of us in all of our communities. Water taxis, right? Electric water taxis from Sausalito to San Francisco. Rather than jumping in a car, why not take a beautiful ride across the waterway? and I think Fola mentioned this about electrification, you know, we need more energy independence. So resilience hubs, ways to create a non grid dependent, electrification.
So that would be my dream– more houseboats, some raised infrastructure and energy independence.
Carlyle: Well, this is so exciting to think about reimagining cities because, as we all know, cities are, you know, kind of where it's at and more and more people are going to be living in them. And so how can we make them thriving places in the future? And I'm inspired from this conversation and talking with all of you and want to thank you all for joining us from different parts of the globe.
Everyone: Thank you so much for having us.
OUTRO
Thanks for listening to Sea Change. This episode was hosted by Halle Parker and me, Carlyle Calhoun. I produced this episode with editing help from Eva Tesfaye and Garrett Hazelwood. Our sound designer is Emily Jankowski and our theme music is by Jon Batiste.
Sea Change is a WWNO and WRKF production. We're a part of the NPR Podcast Network and distributed by PRX. SeaChange is made possible with major support from the Gulf Research Program of the National Academy of Sciences, Engineering, and Medicine. WWNO's Coastal Desk is supported by the Walton Family Foundation, the Meraux and the Greater New Orleans Foundation. We'll be back in two weeks!